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Evil Ryu
03-16-2004, 06:39 PM
Does anyone which Joes died(besides Mainframe and Tripwire, a shame)in this latest story arc with Serpentor?

Sgt_Flash
03-16-2004, 06:42 PM
Tripwire's not dead.

Flash, Mainframe, Chuckles, and Skidmark were the full-fledged Joes that died in DD G.I. Joe #25.

Evil Ryu
03-16-2004, 06:48 PM
Sorry, got Tripwire confused with Flash. Thanks for the info. Were the ones that were shot just wounded?

flounnderr
03-18-2004, 04:11 AM
mainframe and flash aren't dead till i see a body! (famous words of a true comic historian)

or does anybody not remember the Saw Viper's inexplicable return from a snakeyes and stormshadow assault

Dominic Guglieme
03-18-2004, 03:26 PM
Well, as comic fans, we should also know that the whole "not dead w/o a body" rule only applies to the bad guys like Sawviper.

Good guys, like Chuckles etal, tend to stay dead.

Graz73
03-19-2004, 07:24 AM
That's one of the reasons that I like joe comics... Its one of the few series that DOESNT bring dead characters back. Sure there are exceptions (damn Serpentor) but for the most part, characters in GI Joe stay dead. (At least the good guys)

theterminator69
03-19-2004, 07:50 AM
I dont Agree with Devils crap comics so therefore it does not apply to me!

Billy - The Cobra Son
03-19-2004, 11:42 AM
Yeah, I thing so about the deaths of Joes in the New Series... for me, some of them are dead.... others don't.... the Marvel origianl series killed Quick Kick and Breaker... and Devil Due/Image killed Flash and Chuckles..!

Oh, come on!!

danyanda
03-19-2004, 02:13 PM
In response to the people that said characters who are dead tend to stay dead, I tend to lean more towards the not dead without a body, and even then they could still come back.

Snake Eyes - how many times did he buy it early on in the series? His heart stopped at least twice (issue 10 with Dr Venom, and issue 95 with the Paine Brothers), and he was bombed in issue 13. Then the was the time that Cobra troopers hit him with dozens of grenades in Sierra Gordo or somewhere. There are really too many to count.

Storm Shadow - Was killed and brought back to life by Mindbender's Serpentor experiment (thank goodness none of the completely decayed guys came back to life) in issue 50 or so

Scarlett took a .45 to the skull from about 2 inches away and came out fine only to have Snake Eyes shove a sword right through her but not kill her. Maybe weak examples since we were never told she was dead.

Of the freighter cobras, Zartan and Billy escaped. Firefly's body was presumably found but it turns out it was not really his body at all. Dr. Mindbender was dead and sat on the freighter for years, but was brought back to life by being stuck in a tank, dropped on the ground, and electrocuted.

Baroness got blown up in a tank (16?) but she lived, too.

Oh, and I almost forgot, Cobra Commander was shot, dead, and buried... but he wasn't really dead, just critically wounded, which slowed his respiration enough to let him live through being buried alive, and gosh, a loyal crimson guardsman dug him up, threw him in the back seat of his impala, and transported him to some covert medical facility where old CC made a full recovery.

and that was all in the Marvel run.

Devil's Due has killed off a few, but apparently Snake Eyes and Storm Shadow couldn't take care of a super tough SAW Viper, and getting shot throught the eye with an arrow isn't enough to REALLY kill Serpentor.

I'm still waiting for Scarface, Kwinn, and anyone from the freighter who hasn't already to come back to life. It'll happen, you'll see.

[ March 19, 2004: Message edited by: danyanda ]

Sgt_Flash
03-21-2004, 11:53 AM
Good point, danyanda. I think the more "realistic" Joe fans tend to forget that the G.I. Joe book is a comic, not a documentary on the History Channel. Nice work on the chronology. smile.gif

Sgt_Flash
03-21-2004, 11:55 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Evil Ryu:
Sorry, got Tripwire confused with Flash. Thanks for the info. Were the ones that were shot just wounded?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

No prob; I figured as much. smile.gif Since Brandon Jerwa himself hasn't mentioned the wounded as dead on his message board, I'm guessing that the Joes wounded in #25 (Outback springs to mind, but I don't remember any others offhand) will make a full recovery.

gunslingercbr
03-21-2004, 12:02 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by theterminator69:
I dont Agree with Devils crap comics so therefore it does not apply to me!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

comics only apply to comics, Marvel or Devils Due, not you as a person.

Dominic Guglieme
03-22-2004, 10:43 AM
Looks like Heavy Duty may also have died at the hands of some NeoVipers.

As for danyanda's list, let me add my two cents.....

Snakeeye returnning form the dead was always explained in context as relating to ninja training, like it or not.

Stormshadow's death/rebirth was planned as such from the moment he was shot. It fit in with Hama's moral ladder.

I tend to think Zartan and Billy were planned to return. Hama himself said that Firefly was never intended to stay dead. (Early issues of the series support this claim. Firefly was always present on the sidelines of important stuff.)

Cobra Commander is a badguy, so it is okay for him to comeback. (Even if it is backpeddalling by Hama.) Scarlett was a cheap backpedal.....

Serpentor was dead, but ressurected. Either way, he and Baroness, and Mindbender were badguys. So, aback they come........

I also recall Baroness being seriously injured twice. Which were you referencing?

Oh, the October Guard stayed pretty well dead. And, they died messy. :eek:

Shane Davis
04-04-2004, 11:00 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Snake Eyes - how many times did he buy it early on in the series? His heart stopped at least twice (issue 10 with Dr Venom, and issue 95 with the Paine Brothers), and he was bombed in issue 13. Then the was the time that Cobra troopers hit him with dozens of grenades in Sierra Gordo or somewhere. There are really too many to count.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I hate to nitpick, but like it was said before, it was Snakes ninja training that stopped his own heart. He was in a fortified concrete bunker when the Baroness tried to blow it up. Also, when Snakes was fragged in Sierra Gordo, it was specifically stated that they used stun grenades because Dr. Brainwave intentioned on taking Snakes back to the CCB to interrogate him.

I don't like bringing back characters either. If they die, they should die. That is life. I always found it odd that a large-scale war could happen between the Joes and Cobra, and none of the Joes, and only expendable Cobras would die. Trucial Abysma had realism to it, but it was very blatant how Mr. Hama threw in a big ragtag bunch of vehicle drivers and rarely used characters to offer them up in appeasement to the "realism" trend that was going on at that time. Breaker and Doc were surprising, but they already had replacements at that point anyway.

Mr. Jerwa seems to have taken it a baby step forward, allowing well-developed characters like Chuckles and Main-Frame to be terminated, but then once again Serpentor is still hanging around. *sigh*

All that said, I can see why killing off characters is hard for writers. Since this comic is only published once a month, it takes time to introduce characters and have the readers get to know them. Killing them off at that point seems like a waste of time. On the other hand, popping in a character just to kill him off in the same episode (*cough cough* Cool Breeze *cough cough*), seems pretty cheap too. The "Greenshirts" were a good alternative conjured up by Mr. Blaylock, but once again, they just seemed to be dead men walking.

So is there anyway to handle this without causing problems with some fans? Hell no!!! All writers seems to struggle with it, and we fans have to accept certain things in this Joe Universe. The most important is - TIME IS RELATIVE. Next, if it can fit into the storyline somehow, accept it. It was much easier for me as a kid though. LOL

Angry Beef
04-04-2004, 10:07 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Shane Davis:


On the other hand, popping in a character just to kill him off in the same episode (*cough cough* Cool Breeze *cough cough*), seems pretty cheap too. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>


.......or Mariner.

ShortFuze
04-12-2004, 01:04 AM
Mariner hasn't gotten drowned yet...soon...just not yet! lol

Xerofall
04-13-2004, 02:09 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by danyanda:
and that was all in the Marvel run.

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Amen danyanda

:D

Toy-Classifieds.com
04-13-2004, 02:34 AM
Comics are supposed to be the hardcore reality addon to such characters anyways so death is a acceptable risk in the story lines I figure.

Anyobody ever kill Crystal Ball..........lol

Graz73
04-13-2004, 07:18 AM
I think Hama tried to kill characters as much as they would let him.

Think about this... Nearly all of his big "Non Toy" characters were killed...

Kwinn
Dr Venom
Gen. Flagg just to name a few...

Dominic Guglieme
04-13-2004, 06:16 PM
The only context for Crystal Ball lists him as dead.

He got a trading card in an old set about 12 years back. It listed him as having been lost in the collapse of Cobra La.

Evil Ryu
04-22-2004, 02:06 PM
When the Joes were at Arlington(?)mourning their fallen comrades, who were the names on the stone?

Andrew Molinari
05-08-2004, 09:03 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by flounnderr:
mainframe and flash aren't dead till i see a body! (famous words of a true comic historian)

or does anybody not remember the Saw Viper's inexplicable return from a snakeyes and stormshadow assault<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Wrong... comic book characters are never truly dead until the company that owns them allows the license to run out.

HICKS
05-14-2004, 10:47 AM
A good story line to bring about in the new series would be cloning all the fallen joes just to have them killed off again, it would really bring about more intensity in the comic for the characters if they ever decide to do a story line like that I hope it's one that last more then 5 issues seems like it could breath even more life into are favorite joes. This would also give us a chance to see the joes personal realtionships with these characters frome the past. hey if mindbender can be cloned then so can the fallen good guys. I think it would be an awesome story line that would have the Joes at the mercy of their fallen members. as well as develope more joes from the marvel series.

Blackjack
05-19-2004, 02:02 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by danyanda:
Dr. Mindbender was dead and sat on the freighter for years, but was brought back to life by being stuck in a tank, dropped on the ground, and electrocuted.

[ March 19, 2004: Message edited by: danyanda ]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I though Dr. Mindbender stayed dead after dying on the freighter, but was later cloned. And that is the Mindbender we have now.

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by danyanda:
and getting shot throught the eye with an arrow isn't enough to REALLY kill Serpentor.[ March 19, 2004: Message edited by: danyanda ]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is only a minor setback. But if Serpentor wasn't really dead, then whose body did Firefly put his uniform on to make everyone think he was dead? He claimed that the rest of the group on the freighter had forgotten about Serpentor's body, and that was why he was able to use it to fake his death.

Dominic Guglieme
05-19-2004, 03:15 PM
Serpentor was dead, but his cadaver was regenerated. Same idea with Mindbender.

The explanation for the corpse on the ship (used by Firefly) was that The Coil (while still a clandestine group) swapped out Serpentor's corpse for another long before Cobra Commander returned. This was so unltra hush-hush that even Mindbender was unaware. So, the body Firefly used was just some poor nameless schlub.

[ May 19, 2004: Message edited by: Dominic Guglieme ]

Rygn
05-28-2004, 01:45 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Andrew Molinari:


Wrong... comic book characters are never truly dead until the company that owns them allows the license to run out.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I agree. I have another question. I hope someone that knows can answer this.

Does a comic line (Marvel/Devil's Due) need Hasbro's consent to ABSOLUTLEY terminate a character? This does not include Comic created characters like "Cool Breeze" or "Daemon" :confused:

theterminator69
05-28-2004, 05:58 PM
Is anyone in need of the issue where alot of joes die it's 111 i think? PM me

theterminator69
05-28-2004, 06:01 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>comics only apply to comics, Marvel or Devils Due, not you as a person. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

No i beg to differ it does not APPLY to me cuz i dont agree with it. They can print out all the joe comics they want it's still garabge unless Hama is doin it. So there for it does not apply smile.gif

thebigzakbowski
05-28-2004, 06:24 PM
someone told me skidmark died. when did that happen?

Graz73
06-25-2004, 05:06 AM
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Rygn:


I agree. I have another question. I hope someone that knows can answer this.

Does a comic line (Marvel/Devil's Due) need Hasbro's consent to ABSOLUTLEY terminate a character? This does not include Comic created characters like "Cool Breeze" or "Daemon" :confused:<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

From interviews I've read with Larry Hama, and forum discussions with Jerwa, YES, the writers of the comic need permission from Hasbro to kill any joes. Jerwa said that he would have killed other joes in #25 (maybe Rock-n-Roll) but that Flash and the others were the guys that Hasbro said to kill...

I would have to guess that the writers don't need permission to kill comic-only characters. (Probably unless there is a figure in the works)

Also, someone said: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR> "Looks like Heavy Duty may also have died at the hands of some NeoVipers.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
When was that?

[ June 25, 2004: Message edited by: Graz73 ]

Joe Camel
06-25-2004, 11:42 AM
This thread is why I like the cartoon. Nobody dies.......EVER! If Baronesss would've been in that tank in the cartoon,she would've for sure bailed out right through the explosion,and fire. And as far as Snake Eyes goes, the equivalent of him ever dying would be the same as Superman,or Captain America dying....NOT GONNA HAPPEN! I think the same goes for Stormy too,and who oh who would G.I.Joe fight if Cobra Commander died. It just would'nt be the same at all ie IT WOULD SUCK BIG!! Besides, Flash is'nt dead either,He's right here on my computer desk....hmmm lets see....YUP there's Chuckles too. Who else is still alive over here....seems to be EVERYBODY. How can they be alive you ask,after all they are only toys....WELL YOU GUYS ARE TALKING ABOUT DEAD COMIC PEOPLE....SAME DIFFERENCE. I think every comic hero in existence has "died" at least once,and then months later...DUN DUN DUNNN....they're back again doing the same thing they always did. So,with that said,lets just read the comic for entertainment value instead of a real life newspaper obituary,and be happy that G.I.Joe will in fact NEVER DIE.

(looking for my fork to stick in this thread)

the joe bandit
06-25-2004, 01:56 PM
<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by thebigzakbowski:
someone told me skidmark died. when did that happen?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I am not sure which isssue of DD (i think it was 25?), but during the Cobra Island Battle. A helicopter crashed getting him and just missing Duke? I could be wrong, but I think that is how it happened!

CountryOutlaw
10-13-2005, 09:52 AM
Granted there son.
In the cartoon nobody dies.
But explain to me how Steeler, Grunt, and Clutch. Who don't die, but stay in a parallel universe aren't considered MIA? (Worlds Without End)
MIA isn't dead by deaths standards, but they are still not with us.:confused:
But yet then again, it's just a cartoon. And Hasbro still made Grunt and Clutch and eventually a Steeler action figure.;)
Which I do own.
The original Grunt(82),Steeler(82), and Clutch(82 V1 green) action figures are still buried in my folks backyard. (Yes I buried them after I saw the cartoon. I was after all 13-14)

CountryOutlaw
10-13-2005, 10:12 AM
I'm not quite sure of all of the name's but I think it's

Gen. Flagg
Gen. Ryan

Doc
Crank Case
Heavy Metal
Thunder

Breaker
Crazy Legs
Quick Kick

Cool Breeze

Sneak Peak
Avalanche
Blaster
Blocker
Knockdown
Maverick
Dee-Jay

For a list of all Comic book related deaths, see the other "dead joes" thread.
Post #2 by Crossfire. It's a link to a great page of this info.