GI Joe Collector's Club Teases New Figures

[jlw515]

You may want to still consider becoming a member. The Club puts individual figures up for sale in the Club store after they're shipped, so if you just want ones and twos, you can buy them straight from the Club store as long as you have a membership, even if you didn't buy a sub.

Yeah I think I'm gonna join. The subscription and figure sounds like a cool deal.

Jason

[nickvree]

You may want to still consider becoming a member. The Club puts individual figures up for sale in the Club store after they're shipped, so if you just want ones and twos, you can buy them straight from the Club store as long as you have a membership, even if you didn't buy a sub.

Assuming they don't sell out first. But I don't see TF Airtight being in high demand.

[jlw515]

Assuming they don't sell out first. But I don't see TF Airtight being in high demand.

I was simply using Airtight as an example. Falcon looks cool but should be renamed as Flint.

Jason

[nickvree]

Thanks for the info. So using the $375 amount, and dividing it by 13 (because you actually get 13 figures) comes out to almost $29 per figure. Too rich for my blood! I'm not that big of a collector. I could see completist participating in this, but this isn't really for guys like me that just want certain figures.

This is one aspect of Joe collecting that kind of has me confused and discouraged. I've been a Modern Star Wars collector since '95. Hasbro has from time to time offered club exclusives and convention exclusives, but the cost and availability seems to have been better than with Joes. And usually he "exclusive" was offered to the general public later on as a repaint or something. Well, no offense, but with Joes it almost seems like an elitism to certain types of collecting. If I want Tiger Force Airtight, I'm going to pay $375 for 13 figures. Or if I can't afford to attend Convention X I'll never be able to own the Oktober Guard set or Night Force Lady Jaye. I guess I can understand offering certain exclusive variants (Tiger Force, Night Force, etc), or things like the Star Scream Skystriker, but it would really be nice if Hasbro would rerelease some of these exclusives (Covergirl, Oktober Guard, etc) with a different paint app to the general public.that way it's not so much the "character" that is exclusive (I'm thinking Zarana & others), rather than a particular paint scheme. Thanks again

Jason

I guess I don't disagree with much here - exclusives are really expensive, which sucks. Heck, I didn't get FSS 1.0 because of this, and really wish I had. But you have to look at it from a business perspective - they're moving 1-2k units (taking a guess here); Hasbro moves a couple orders of magnitude more than that, so the cost to design these, produce these, market these, etc. is going to be significantly higher. Also, SW is much more popular as well, so those exclusives can be cheaper.

As far as re-releasing them... I think if there was a business reason to do this, they would. But given the few figures we get per year from Hasbro, they're probably not going to take up a slot on giving us Cover Girl instead of Budo or a movie-inspired Storm Shadow. The name recognition just isn't there.

[Kronz]

Wow, I feel like I could have written jlw555's post myself. I love GI Joe, I really do, but it was always much more populist growing up. It's hard to adjust to the growth of a toy line into the adult collectible market. Really, they make no bones about it either, these expensive rare toys are not even for kids at all, says so right on the box. When I started collecting 25th style the convention and club stuff was still O-ring so I didn't feel it was a big deal to miss out on them, and it made me feel confident I could keep up at retail. I splurged and bought Doc and some store exclusives I'd missed at a mark up and that was painful enough. With the O-ring figures I'd sure like to have them all but it has never been an active goal, and knowing that maybe a dozen people in the world or less really have them all put my mind at ease (depending on what you count as complete, of course). But 25th seemed doable. Not any more. Now I just play with the ones I have and enjoy pictures of the stuff as it comes out. I should stress, I'd even like it just if all the ARAH-to-25th came out at retail, I would be happy letting the rest be rare and exclusive and still collect. But I can't even get Footloose or Zarana for pete's sake, not to mention the barely existent retail waves that held Crazy Legs, Airtight and Lifeline, for example. That doesn't help either.

[jlw515]

I guess I don't disagree with much here - exclusives are really expensive, which sucks. Heck, I didn't get FSS 1.0 because of this, and really wish I had. But you have to look at it from a business perspective - they're moving 1-2k units (taking a guess here); Hasbro moves a couple orders of magnitude more than that, so the cost to design these, produce these, market these, etc. is going to be significantly higher. Also, SW is much more popular as well, so those exclusives can be cheaper.

As far as re-releasing them... I think if there was a business reason to do this, they would. But given the few figures we get per year from Hasbro, they're probably not going to take up a slot on giving us Cover Girl instead of Budo or a movie-inspired Storm Shadow. The name recognition just isn't there.

Not sure how much you know about SW collecting, but I don't know that you can honestly say SW is more popular than Joe at this time. The preview of SW figures for 2013 was slim to none, the CW cartoon has been cancelled, there hasn't been any new SW action figures on pegs since before Christmas. Also (in the past) Hasbro had to pay LFL royalty for the SW line. Compare that to Joe, which has a current blockbuster movie, hype already for number 3, and the old school hard core collectors. Plus Hasbro owns Joe, so they don't pay royalty to anyone. So now would be the perfect time to revamp the line and get products on the shelf - movie related or not.

I guess as a newbie modern collector (I am an old school Joe fan from 82 to 87) it discourages me that characters like the Oktober Guard are super exclusive, and now with Dragonsky and Big Bear offered through the FSS I either have the choice of paying almost $30 per figure (higher on after market) or just doing without. I understand the Oktober Guard (and other characters) might not be the right choice for the retail pegs, but lets not make them so exclusive that only the "chosen ones" even have access to them.

Just my ramblings...

Jason

[Manic]

Thanks for the info. So using the $375 amount, and dividing it by 13 (because you actually get 13 figures) comes out to almost $29 per figure. Too rich for my blood! I'm not that big of a collector. I could see completist participating in this, but this isn't really for guys like me that just want certain figures.

This is one aspect of Joe collecting that kind of has me confused and discouraged. I've been a Modern Star Wars collector since '95. Hasbro has from time to time offered club exclusives and convention exclusives, but the cost and availability seems to have been better than with Joes. And usually he "exclusive" was offered to the general public later on as a repaint or something. Well, no offense, but with Joes it almost seems like an elitism to certain types of collecting. If I want Tiger Force Airtight, I'm going to pay $375 for 13 figures. Or if I can't afford to attend Convention X I'll never be able to own the Oktober Guard set or Night Force Lady Jaye. I guess I can understand offering certain exclusive variants (Tiger Force, Night Force, etc), or things like the Star Scream Skystriker, but it would really be nice if Hasbro would rerelease some of these exclusives (Covergirl, Oktober Guard, etc) with a different paint app to the general public.that way it's not so much the "character" that is exclusive (I'm thinking Zarana & others), rather than a particular paint scheme. Thanks again

Jason

Here's what I don't understand from people whose biggest gripes are about the price and availability. It's just basic economics, supply and demand really, which set the prices for these things. It's not like the Collector's Club, or even Hasbro, is thinking how can we make figures cost the most possible so that only the "elite" can afford them. There is a certain percentage of profit that the Club (and Hasbro) needs to make on ALL of the items they sell for it to remain a viable business. Whatever that number is, is used to set the price points for their items. It varies from item to item because the cost differs across those items, but at the end of the day they need to make X amount of dollars to stay open. What I don't think many people know, or even think about, is that the final price that an item is given is the highest amount that the Club thinks people will pay for an item at retail. This is true for every business out there, Hasbro, McDonald's, Walmart, etc. you name it. The Club and Hasbro are in business to make money, period. Not to make toys for pennies on the dollar. (it is likely however that this is the case with some of their items)

At the same time, they need to decide how many of each item to make, with the hopes of selling every unit at their highest retail price. Anything sold below that number cuts into their profit and financial performance. This is what often creates the shortage of the number of figures available - if they are afraid of not selling out, they will make fewer so that they don't have to sell ANY at a price point lower than their final decided retail price. (which remember is the highest price they think people will pay) The Club's idea of a FSS is really pretty brilliant; they are setting the supply by allowing people to order as many as they would like. In theory, with the FSS the supply and demand should be about equal since those who are demanding the product are in charge of creating the supply. The exceptions to this are collector's who don't know about the club, or find out about the FSS at a future time. This is where the 2nd market is created, which is 100% demand driven. If the supply is limited, and the demand is high, then prices will go up. It is not created by Hasbro or the Collector's club, or anyone else, but is completely created by those who want the limited supply items. These folks will then compete financially to gain one, and therefore the price is then inflated.

The alternative is to have prices so low that there is no Club, or no GI Joe line at all, because it is not financially feasible as a business. If price is a sticking point for a lot of people then they should continue to seek out the item they want, at the price they deem acceptable. If that doesn't happen then they just don't get the item. It's really just that simple. The club has made their items easily accessible: If you want a con set, you can order one to be shipped to you, or you can attend the show. If you want the con exclusives you can go to the show, or pay 2nd market prices, if you want an item bad enough. If you want the figures in the FSS, you can register for them and they will be shipped to you. Others will be available in the club store at a later time. You don't need to be a "chosen one" to get all of these, but you must be willing to pay. I think it's better to just focus on the fact that something we like so much is even available at all. And if we wan to buy something, we can! Prices aren't always what we'd like things to be, but I don't think it's fair to blame the club or Hasbro because they are running a business selling the things we like.

[tmc008]

And don't forget, Fun Publications owns the Club and has to pay Hasbro to use the license.

[nickvree]

Agree totally with you Manic.

[jlw515]

Here's what I don't understand from people whose biggest gripes are about the price and availability. It's just basic economics, supply and demand really, which set the prices for these things. It's not like the Collector's Club, or even Hasbro, is thinking how can we make figures cost the most possible so that only the "elite" can afford them. There is a certain percentage of profit that the Club (and Hasbro) needs to make on ALL of the items they sell for it to remain a viable business. Whatever that number is, is used to set the price points for their items. It varies from item to item because the cost differs across those items, but at the end of the day they need to make X amount of dollars to stay open. What I don't think many people know, or even think about, is that the final price that an item is given is the highest amount that the Club thinks people will pay for an item at retail. This is true for every business out there, Hasbro, McDonald's, Walmart, etc. you name it. The Club and Hasbro are in business to make money, period. Not to make toys for pennies on the dollar. (it is likely however that this is the case with some of their items)

At the same time, they need to decide how many of each item to make, with the hopes of selling every unit at their highest retail price. Anything sold below that number cuts into their profit and financial performance. This is what often creates the shortage of the number of figures available - if they are afraid of not selling out, they will make fewer so that they don't have to sell ANY at a price point lower than their final decided retail price. (which remember is the highest price they think people will pay) The Club's idea of a FSS is really pretty brilliant; they are setting the supply by allowing people to order as many as they would like. In theory, with the FSS the supply and demand should be about equal since those who are demanding the product are in charge of creating the supply. The exceptions to this are collector's who don't know about the club, or find out about the FSS at a future time. This is where the 2nd market is created, which is 100% demand driven. If the supply is limited, and the demand is high, then prices will go up. It is not created by Hasbro or the Collector's club, or anyone else, but is completely created by those who want the limited supply items. These folks will then compete financially to gain one, and therefore the price is then inflated.

The alternative is to have prices so low that there is no Club, or no GI Joe line at all, because it is not financially feasible as a business. If price is a sticking point for a lot of people then they should continue to seek out the item they want, at the price they deem acceptable. If that doesn't happen then they just don't get the item. It's really just that simple. The club has made their items easily accessible: If you want a con set, you can order one to be shipped to you, or you can attend the show. If you want the con exclusives you can go to the show, or pay 2nd market prices, if you want an item bad enough. If you want the figures in the FSS, you can register for them and they will be shipped to you. Others will be available in the club store at a later time. You don't need to be a "chosen one" to get all of these, but you must be willing to pay. I think it's better to just focus on the fact that something we like so much is even available at all. And if we wan to buy something, we can! Prices aren't always what we'd like things to be, but I don't think it's fair to blame the club or Hasbro because they are running a business selling the things we like.

I get the whole supply and demand, but my point is that certain characters are only available as super exclusive figures such as convention figures. I worked retail for years, even managed for 3 years. So I understand cost and gross profit margin. In the retail store toys have a 100% mark up. In fact most of what you buy at say Wal-Mart, has a high profit margin. So an item that cost say $10 at retail will typically cost the store $3 to $5. Now as far as Hasbro exclusives go, they've cut out the middle man (retailer). So, why would the cost of an online or convention exclusive be 3 times the retail price? If you look at the FSS figures (or most modern Joe figures for that matter), they are using Pre-existing molds, so there shouldn't be any extra "tooling" cost (or it should be minimum in the case of a new head sculpt). And then apparently from the post above Hasbro is also getting a cut from Fun Publication. So I don't really see any justification for the $29 per figure price. Now, I understand I am the consumer and if I don't like the price I don't have to buy the product - which I'm not. My major discouragement is that certain characters are exclusive. Again, I understand something like a Star Scream Skystriker being a convention exclusive, but not (for example) the Skystriker itself. Or another example, I understand black shirt Zarana being an exclusive, but not Zarana herself. See outside of a convention exclusive there is no modern Zarana figure.

And simply comparing the hobby with another Hasbro brand (SW), you don't have the same issues - never have. With SW, Hasbro has offered exclusive variants, but not the entire character itself. For example, goofy smile Pilot Luke Skywalker was an exclusive, not pilot Luke himself meaning the only way to own Luke in his X-Wing outfit would be to own the exclusive. Well, from what I've seen that's not the case with Joes, and it doesn't seem fair to collectors as a whole to me seeing as how only certain people can afford to attend conventions or subscribe to the FSS. Hate to sound like an old man, but it wasn't like that in the past.

Jason