It variesOriginally Posted by SteveB
I'd like to add the idea of graded vehicles to the discussion. I have always loved vehcicles anyway, and I have been picking a few up as a good example to add to certain series I have. Without getting too into it, here is an example. I have some orignal Hasbro presentation art for the AGP. I had it matted and framed, then added a nice AFA 85 AGP put with it. It is like having the earliest finished concept of the vehicle, with the final finished toy in optimum condition.
I like the graded vehicles because they are well protected. Sealed vintage vehicles can take a lot of damage in transit, storage, etc, and having sealed examples graded preserves them well.
There was a good run of graded vehicles put up several months ago, I am sure Type S remembers this, he and i were warring pretty well over some of them. A few went pretty high, but some went so low that they seemd to be losing money when you consider the cost of the grading and casing (i was told casing for most vehicles starts at about $35-40.) and the cost of the Vehicle. I think I won the AGP for less than $100, and an 85 Skystorm for a little over $100. Regardless of the grading, that seemed almost dead on retail cost of vehicle PLUS the grading in both cases. So, I think these are great pieces, and they don't seem to command the difference in final value that grading sometimes causes in figures graded VS ungraded.
But I also wonder, how can they use the same criteria as a figure? The ratio of a box size VS the window size should be a lot higher than bubble Vs a Card, BUT on the larger size, they can allow for a larger rate of imperfections. I had asked them about having my Sealed defiant done, the cost would almost be prohibitive in that unless it did very well, like an overall 85, I would lose money if I ever sold it after the cost of the grading and the cost of the piece when I bought it. That wasn't really my concern, I was just hoping to preserve it, and it would make a nice coffee table LOL. i was also considering having a sealed general done, how would they grade a piece with no figure window or visible figure? Does it drop down to a single grade again? I am sure they do pieces like this (vintage SW vehicles have been done), I just have not looked into it myself and was looking for info.
But i will say they look GOOD. Sealed vehicles are so tough to find, I almost always find them with sealed contents but with the Tape cut or dried up. I like the idea of having them cased and untouchable.
With graded vehicles aren't they grading just the box? How can they even attempt to grade something that they completely cannot see? And with that in mind, why not just have them grade an empty box? If you send them a sealed box there's no telling what may actually be inside the box. It's one thing to AFA a figure where you can actually see what's there to buy. But vehicles are just sealed and enclosed boxes. Who knows what might actually be inside one of them.
On mine, it says "box-window-figure" for the grades, it doesn't seem to have anything to do with the vehicle inside. I would hope they could tell if you sent a taped up box with a brick inside. I was just wondering how heavily they weigh the figure and window vs the box itself, I would think it would be a lot less that a figure and bubble vs the card. In the case of vehicles that have no visible figure, do they revert back to a single grade?
I don't know specifics about the figure v/s vehicle etc in compliling a final score, but I do know that it is much more difficult to find pristine examples of boxed (as opposed to carded) toys. Just check out the Transformers that have been graded by AFA on ebay (or ask some Transformer fans). It is much more difficult to find highly graded specimens than, say Star Wars. Same goes with GI Joe vehicles. AFA 75-80 would be a very good grade for a GI Joe vehicle to get IMO.
I haven't read all of the postings in this thread yet (so my opinions may be in line with others here or not) but I still think that AFA is a perfect idea for high grade vintage carded figures and boxed vehicles. It is an excellent way to ascertain relative condition on ebay, and a nifty way to display awesome pieces and "holy grails." I really like the Archival Tier, which encases the figures in UV protective casing--absolutely perfect for display and you never have to worry about sunlight. I still don't see any reason to grade loose figures, though.
In response to Type*S*Toys' original query:
I recently received a batch of AFA Joes:
Major Bludd 20-back (AFA 80: 80/85/85)
Crimson Guard Commanders (AFA 80: 80/85/90)
Crimson Guard Commanders (AFA 80: 80/85/85)
Zartan w/ Swamp Skier (AFA 80: 80/85/90)
Having 2 Transformers AFA 85 vehicles (Sunstreaker and Bluestreak), I'm a bit surprised at the Zartan grade. The box is comparable to the G1 AFA 85s. I'm probably going to resend the Zartan and the higher Crimson Guard Commanders.
A GI JOE AFA 80 is fairly consistent with C9. I've had several 80's and they all looked about the same, some better than others.
has anyone submitted any loose Joes to be graded by AFA? Has anyone received any back?
Yup, I submitted a Mickey Mouse cc and hooded cc for loose grading but have not got them back yet.
This is really weird. I mean if someone is going to make a fake/bootleg why make it of a item that is not very valuable. I believe this is part of the reason it slipped past AFA in the first place. Has anyone ever heard of or come across any US carded Joe bootlegs?Originally Posted by the scarecrow