I snipe auctions--deal with it!

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\r\n I snipe auctions-' + '-deal with it!\r\n

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\r\n OK, first I want to say that I routinely try to help people out on this website and I love to answer questions for people. I am a firm believer in the old adage that knowledge is power, but I also believe that if you have information that will help someone you need to share it. As a result, when I learned how to make avatars I noticed a lot of other people didn\'t have them so I have been trying my best to make as many as possible. Also, if someone has a question about something and I can help them I will reply to their thread, and I appreciate all the people who have done the same for me.
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\r\nHaving said that, I now want to talk about ebay. I recently received an email from someone telling me to stop sniping auctions on ebay. In fact, here is the email (minus the user\'s name):
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\r\nDan, I\'ve noticed you have been bidding a lot at the last second on auctions that I have also bid on. I\'m just going to say this once, but, not cool. I have a very long memory and more importantly, a reputation well in advance of yours in the community. Two can play that sniping game if you want to play that way. Otherwise, cut it out and bid ethically.
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\r\nI just want to say that he is right in that I do routinely use an auction sniper for auctions I am interested in. I use the sniper for two reasons:
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\r\n1) I work weird hours and I don\'t have time to sit and watch auctions; in fact, I\'ve been outbid while I was at work on several items I really wanted and that is why I started sniping in the first place.
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\r\n2) Generally, I pay less for the item than if I get into a bidding war with someone else. I have seen auctions go for three times what they are actually worth because two people got into a bidding contest.
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\r\nI\'m not making excuses for the sniping and I am going to continue doing it. I am also going to continue helping as many people as I can with whatever I can. So far, I have filled every single request for avatars I have received. Does auction sniping make me a bad person? I don\'t know, but if you collect paperwork or other licensed collectibles you may have been sniped by me on ebay before and I apologize in advance for the future snipings to come. For those of you that have a problem with it I invite you to find an auction sniping service of your own. Just do a search at google.com and you will find several. Auction sniping isn\'t illegal and everyone can do it so jump on the bandwagon! I do regret bidding (and sniping) against other members on this board but please keep in mind that a lot of the items I bid on are fairly rare and I don\'t want to pass them up. If these items were listed every week or even every month I wouldn\'t snipe them.
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\r\nThis is my philosophy on it-' + '-what do you think?
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\r\nDan\r\n
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My Want List: http://forums.yojoe.com/showthread.php?t=34870 Email me at dmooretoys @ yahoo.com (remove spaces) and let\'s deal!
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    \r\n This is going to be an ugly thread, I can see it now.
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    \r\nThere are obviously two different sides to this, those who snipe, and those who dislike the idea of sniping.
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    \r\nPersonally, I have done some sniping, but usually only when I stumble upon an auction near the end, or I have already been outbid earlier in the auction process.
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    \r\nWhat I would like to see is that if a bid is placed within the last minute, the previous bidder is given a chance to place a follow-up bid. Just one, no incremental bids. A last chance if you will.
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    \r\nWhat really gets me is being outbid by someone who has not expressed interest in the item before.\r\n
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    \r\n Ugly thread indeed. I for one see nothing wrong or unethical about sniping. Also see nothing in the ebay rules warning against this practice. If you want to snipe, snipe. If you want to combat snipers...you have to snipe them. As far as not expressing interest in an item goes...it may not be public intrest. The seller will know if some others have intrest due to the number of people that have their item on their watch list. I have been sniped many times on ebay but I just take it in stride. It apparently wasnt meant for me to have it. If you are worried about being sniped...make your high bid higher than you think a sniper will bid. I dont know how these \'programs\' work for ebay. All bidding I have done is when I am sitting in front of the computer.\r\n
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    Sinnister
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    \nThe master race is made of plastic and only 3 3/4 inches tall
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    \r\n [QUOTE=sinnister]If you want to combat snipers...you have to snipe them. [QUOTE]
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    \r\nOr simply boycott them by holding them in contempt. The community we have warrants at least some standard of ethical conduct. ebay, my friends, is NOT WAR (despite the need of some to always equate GIJOE with the right to war).\r\n
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    \r\n [[email protected]][QUOTE=sinnister]If you want to combat snipers...you have to snipe them.
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    \r\nOr simply boycott them by holding them in contempt. The community we have warrants at least some standard of ethical conduct. ebay, my friends, is NOT WAR (despite the need of some to always equate GIJOE with the right to war).\r\n \r\n
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    I am not \'equating GIJOE with the right to war\'. Bid what you feel is the maximum amount you want to bid and go about your business. If someone outbids you the \'right\' way or by sniping it doesnt matter. You have already bid your max. This is what I do to make sure I dont get into the heat of a bidding war. If I see an item, I bid my max and leave it at that. More often than not I end up being outbid but hey...I offered what I felt was fair and was outbid. I dont hold someone in contempt for bidding more than me whether it is a \'fair bid\' or not. If something is worth 45 bucks to me...its worth 45 bucks...not 50.\r\n
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    Sinnister
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    \nThe master race is made of plastic and only 3 3/4 inches tall
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    \r\n The answer is pretty simple. The highest bidder within the given time is the winner. No more no less! If you get sniped, you should have thrown in a higher bid. I really really don\'t get it people could have something against it. Get over it. I too don\'t like to be sniped but it happens. If I want an item, I\'ll throw in my maximum bid at the very last second. If I get it, I\'m happy, if not I\'m not going to cry about it, should have bid more or will get the next item.
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    \r\nI pretty much always snipe. There are a few online-friends I wouldn\'t outbid, and I\'ve helped out a lot of guys on here and other boards too.\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by Inspector Sledge Hammer\r\n \r\n
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    What I would like to see is that if a bid is placed within the last minute, the previous bidder is given a chance to place a follow-up bid. Just one, no incremental bids. A last chance if you will.
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    \r\nWhat really gets me is being outbid by someone who has not expressed interest in the item before.
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    \r\nI agree with the above point; I would love to see a "last chance" bid for someone who is outbid in the minute.\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by [email protected]\r\n \r\n
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    I agree with the above point; I would love to see a "last chance" bid for someone who is outbid in the minute.
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    As I said...I dont know anything about sniping programs...or how they work. I will bid the max amount I think something is worth to me then if someone wants it more and bids higher with a sniping program so be it. I have already put my MAX bid in. From what it sounds like, others are not putting in their max bids...if they are wanting the opportunity to rebid if they are outbid at the last moment. Like I said, I combat this by just putting in my max and leaving it at that. That being said, I rarely go on ebay anymore at all. Seems more often than not I have not been completely satisfied with the items I have won so I would rather trade or purchase directly from an individual or website.\r\n
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    Sinnister
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    \nThe master race is made of plastic and only 3 3/4 inches tall
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by sinnister\r\n \r\n
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    As I said...I dont know anything about sniping programs...or how they work. I will bid the max amount I think something is worth to me then if someone wants it more and bids higher with a sniping program so be it. I have already put my MAX bid in. From what it sounds like, others are not putting in their max bids...if they are wanting the opportunity to rebid if they are outbid at the last moment. Like I said, I combat this by just putting in my max and leaving it at that. That being said, I rarely go on ebay anymore at all. Seems more often than not I have not been completely satisfied with the items I have won so I would rather trade or purchase directly from an individual or website.
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    Daniel is exactly right. When I snipe I set the maximum amount I am willing to pay for the item and I don\'t always win! The people who I am bidding against also set their maximum amount, or should have. The only difference is when the bid actually takes place.
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    My Want List: http://forums.yojoe.com/showthread.php?t=34870 Email me at dmooretoys @ yahoo.com (remove spaces) and let\'s deal!
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    \r\n Thumbs up Sniping is both legal and fair. . .\r\n

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    \r\n Read it in the official ebay seller\'s guide at Wal*Mart (or some such endcap book). No matter who writes it. Everyone will tell you this is a fact.
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    \nDeal with it.
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    \nThere\'s some things in life that we don\'t like and make us uncomfortable, and learning to overlook those things proves that type of patience and maturity that we only tell others we have.
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    \nThere is absolutely no "unwritten code of honor" here, or on any other forum. Collectors only claim there is to keep bidders away from what they perceive to be "their own private Joe auction".
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    \r\n So I now have another question-' + '-is it "ethical" to contact a seller on ebay and get them to cancel the auction before someone can bid on it? That has been done to me (Cobra Saboteur Kit) and I can tell you that isn\'t fun either, especially when the person rubs it in your face. The person who did it knows what I am talking about....
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    \r\nI have tried to be a nice guy on ebay and usually I end up getting burned. For example, I intentionally passed up an auction recently a member of this board was the high bidder on and someone else entirely won it!
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    \r\nBelieve it or not, I do consider myself a nice guy and I will do anything I can to help you, I just happen to snipe auctions on ebay.
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    \r\nOh yeah, one more point. I posted a thread in the "wanted" section and someone replied to the thread and said they had some paperwork I was interested in. Is it ethical for someone else to contact them and ask them to trade or sell it to them instead? For those of you who haven\'t figured it out this is the same person who sent me the email I posted earlier. How do I know he contacted the person-' + '-the person I was trading with told me about it and was a good enough person to go through with the trade with me.
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    \r\nThis thread could get ugly as others have already said and I already wish I didn\'t start it. I guess I should have just replied to the person\'s email but I was a little irritated based on a few past experiences. I\'m sure the person doesn\'t even know how offensive it is to constantly hear his "someday your collection will be as big as mine" posts and "someday you will need three storage facilities like me for all your stuff" responses to my threads. I\'ve held my tongue until now even when other members have emailed me about it saying they couldn\'t believe he said that. I also wish this person whould start contributing to this site or trying to help people out instead of keeping everything to himself because I know he does have an impressive collection.
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    \r\nOne last thing to say on this topic-' + '-I don\'t intentionally try to seek out and outbid anyone in particular. When I see an auction I am interested in I set it up to be sniped and I don\'t even know who I am bidding against.
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    My Want List: http://forums.yojoe.com/showthread.php?t=34870 Email me at dmooretoys @ yahoo.com (remove spaces) and let\'s deal!
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    \r\n Thumbs down Don\'t snipe on me.\r\n

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    \r\n I think that with eBay, everyone has gotten beat at some point of another on an auction, yes, we all have to "deal with it." But if you are sniping, that means that you noticed the auction, are watching it, and waiting until the last seconds to bid. The truth is, "bidding wars" may result in prices that do not reflect the average person\'s interpretation of an item\'s value, but THAT IS the marketplace. Worth is determined by the market. If you constantly snipe, you are intentionally trying to "steal a deal" by underminding the market, preventing others from having the chance to "rebid." Its one thing to get a good deal on ebay, sniping is not the same. Its unethical. And, personally, I think that if you are intentionally using a service to snipe others who are members of the same JOE community, it certainly doesn\'t reflect good character on yourself.
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    \r\nIn practice, we could all snipe, yet I never have (though I have stayed vigilent and constantly bid up to the last few seconds myself on items I wanted, or seen things at the last minute and ended up bidding on them). But some people are known to bid at the last few seconds with an outrageous amount, just so they can unquestionably win an auction which is just one reason why people don\'t always (or probably usually) start with their true high price -' + '- indeed, people are entitled to adjust that too!\r\n
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    WANTED: Rise of Cobra & Retailiation movie memoriabilia (from scripts and production items, props, to movie and billboard banners, store signage and larger items!). TOP $
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by [email protected]\r\n \r\n
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    But some people are known to bid at the last few seconds with an outrageous amount, just so they can unquestionably win an auction. . .
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    And if that "outrageous amount" (your vague, opinionated, subjective, theoretical amount, btw) becomes the final bid????
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    \nIt affects the market average, yes. But at the same time, the bidder is expected to pay that same "outrageous" amount. It balances out. The buyer has to shoulder the burden of his bid. There\'s nothing he/she really gets away with when sniping an auction.
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    \nTake the risk if you may, but when you play. . .you pay.
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    \nI\'m a poet & didn\'t know it!
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    \r\n You snipe me I snipe you...\r\n

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    \r\n First, a story: a few months ago I had some Joe auctions running. As usual some of the auctions went up near then end - due to sniping. After they ended I get an email from a person who ended up being the second high bidder on a couple auctions. Turns out he was sniped by the same person on my items. This starts complaining, saying how he REALLY wanted these items and was excited to find them on eBay and wants me to not sell to the high bidder (and sell to him I suppose), but rather reprimand the winner for outbidding him. Well...I just laughed. I didn\'t have the heart to reply becuase all I could have said was something like "Next time bid more!" or like others in this thread have mentioned "deal with it".
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    \r\nWhen it comes to bidding, like BelgianGabber, I almost only snipe. I\'ve been sniped by snipers and done the same to others too. There have been times when I got resniped when only a couple seconds remained - sure I\'ve gotten frustrated with it, but bear in mind these are ONLY action figures. Not something to lose sleep or sanity over.
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    \r\nFurther more, I\'ve found sniping isn\'t fool-proof. On occasion an early bidder may place some extremely high bids that I can\'t match. My friend recently picked up an entire Air Raiders collection on eBay that was in 3 auctions. He bid early (well, 10 minutes is early to me) and won all the auctions. There was one bidder that kept trying to snipe him on the auctions and drove up the prices a combined $70. The sniper lost and my friend probably paid more than he needed to, but got what he wanted.
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    \r\nI had actually planned on getting these items, but prices got high earlier, so I showed my buddy who has virtually bottomless pockets of toy money. He won using his bidding tactic because sniping doesn\'t always work against some bidders.\r\n
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    \r\n Quote Originally Posted by dmooretoys\r\n \r\n
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    Dan, I\'ve noticed you have been bidding a lot at the last second on auctions that I have also bid on. I\'m just going to say this once, but, not cool. I have a very long memory and more importantly, a reputation well in advance of yours in the community. Two can play that sniping game if you want to play that way. Otherwise, cut it out and bid ethically.
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    In regards to this first post. I have to question the person who is questioning Dan\'s ethics for sniping. Using his \'reputation well in advance of yours in the community\' to basically threaten him \'I\'m just going to say this once\' into not sniping him anymore is pretty unethical in my book.\r\n
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    \nThe master race is made of plastic and only 3 3/4 inches tall
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    \r\n How fitting I find this thread after setting 5 auctions in my E-Snipe file.
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    \r\nI used to think sniping was the worst thing you could do to a guy, because I was getting sniped. Makes you feel pretty helpless. I HATED getting sniped and I whined about it too. But it is kill or be killed, and I have lost more auctions because I forget to bid, or have to run to the bathroom, or something stupid like that, than I have been outbid. I had to go to Sears one day, and got back 5 minutes after a really nice painting was won (by a guy in this thread) and I had missed my chance to bid on it.
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    \r\nSniping happens. Deal with it. If it was truly undermining the market, then the market is not strong enough to begin with, and you can blame the underbidder for not bidding high enough. ALL THE SNIPED ARE TO BLAME! BID HIGHER! MAKE THE SNIPERS BLEED!!!
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    \r\nYou argue well, Dan (which you SHOULD given your profession), but you aren\'t gonna get the support here for your "boycott the snipers" platform no matter HOW well you argue, ESPECIALLY if you look under the ethics rock for supporters. Just get an E-Snipe account, set your auctions, and hit the bar. You can see what you won when you get home.\r\n
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    \r\n THIS I disaggree with, but I HAVE done it. Only once, it was for a sealed defiant, the nicest one I had seen. It was local, in Jersey, and the seller had 0 FB. My intentions were less trying to screw othewr bidders, and more trying to be sure it was an authentic auction for myself. i drove out and made an offer, and they ended the auction.
    \r\n
    \r\nNow, as a seller, I refuse to end an auction early for any reason, and when people make me offers, I tell them to just bid. They might get it cheaper than they offer. BUT, I have done it. I did end an auction once, I think, because the buyer made a $20 offer for a $5 item, which is hard to deny. More than once, I have added BIN prices for people if it was a decent price, and once I remember because a mother needed it for a birthday party.
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    \r\nSo, I think that convincing a seller to end an item early is SHADY at best, and if you\'re gonna frown on sniping, you should frown upon that as well, even more so. In my view, it would be like saying theft is wrong, but murder is OK if you benefit from it.
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    \r\nSo, I think it is a poor practice in the face of the much more righteous-but-sneaky Sniping, but I cannot cast the first stone, either.\r\n
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    \r\nArmageddon Toys
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    Join Date
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    \r\n I won\'t bid against friends, and i expect the same (which has gotten me in trouble). I have bidding pacts with some guys, both stated and unstated, and for some i won\'t bid if i see them, just out of a "community courtesy" so to speak. But for me, it only extends to people I know, talk to over Emails, IMs, etc, or see in person and are friendly with. Like, I am friends with Dockingbay, I would not outbid him if I saw him on an auction. But that guy in the cow suit, Snow, he better watch out. I won\'t ever forgive him for what he did to my brother. I have emailed guys and talked about prices, etc, if it is an item i really like, and a lot of my friends have done the same thing for me, to keep each other from bidding each other up. We are almost "conspiring to undermine the market" if you will entertain the notion. I got a PHONE CALL once, asking how high I would go, and if I cared if the bidder outbid me because it was the last piece he needed for a set. That man is TOP NOTCH in my book, and it would be great if we could all be so civilized, but it isn\'t gonna happen. Now, sniping makes this REALLY difficult at times, because sometimes you set a snipe on something that a friend bids on AFTER you set the snipe, and you don\'t bother looking again until that auction ended. That happened to me once so far, and i was happy to apologize, and offer the item to my friend for what I paid (this might be going a bit too far, but it was a good friend).
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    \r\nSo, I won\'t outbid my friends, but I will talk to them about items I want. As for board members, man, there over 4,000 members here, right? You\'re BOUND to outbid SOMEONE, sometime.\r\n
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    1. #1

      I snipe auctions--deal with it!

      OK, first I want to say that I routinely try to help people out on this website and I love to answer questions for people. I am a firm believer in the old adage that knowledge is power, but I also believe that if you have information that will help someone you need to share it. As a result, when I learned how to make avatars I noticed a lot of other people didn't have them so I have been trying my best to make as many as possible. Also, if someone has a question about something and I can help them I will reply to their thread, and I appreciate all the people who have done the same for me.

      Having said that, I now want to talk about ebay. I recently received an email from someone telling me to stop sniping auctions on ebay. In fact, here is the email (minus the user's name):


      Dan, I've noticed you have been bidding a lot at the last second on auctions that I have also bid on. I'm just going to say this once, but, not cool. I have a very long memory and more importantly, a reputation well in advance of yours in the community. Two can play that sniping game if you want to play that way. Otherwise, cut it out and bid ethically.


      I just want to say that he is right in that I do routinely use an auction sniper for auctions I am interested in. I use the sniper for two reasons:

      1) I work weird hours and I don't have time to sit and watch auctions; in fact, I've been outbid while I was at work on several items I really wanted and that is why I started sniping in the first place.

      2) Generally, I pay less for the item than if I get into a bidding war with someone else. I have seen auctions go for three times what they are actually worth because two people got into a bidding contest.

      I'm not making excuses for the sniping and I am going to continue doing it. I am also going to continue helping as many people as I can with whatever I can. So far, I have filled every single request for avatars I have received. Does auction sniping make me a bad person? I don't know, but if you collect paperwork or other licensed collectibles you may have been sniped by me on ebay before and I apologize in advance for the future snipings to come. For those of you that have a problem with it I invite you to find an auction sniping service of your own. Just do a search at google.com and you will find several. Auction sniping isn't illegal and everyone can do it so jump on the bandwagon! I do regret bidding (and sniping) against other members on this board but please keep in mind that a lot of the items I bid on are fairly rare and I don't want to pass them up. If these items were listed every week or even every month I wouldn't snipe them.

      This is my philosophy on it--what do you think?

      Dan
      My Want List: http://forums.yojoe.com/showthread.php?t=34870 Email me at dmooretoys @ yahoo.com (remove spaces) and let's deal!

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