Have you Ever gotten an AFA item that graded high and you were really disappointed???

[Obiwanjacoby]

That chip must be almost unbearable now hey Paul?

Why you holding his hand, Shane? Is there something you two have in common that absolutely must be defended and revisited every time the subject comes up?

No?

Well, okay then.

-PJ

[gutstheberserker]

No one seems to be paying attention to the question, so I will add this and then I'm out.

I don't agree that the grading is inconsistent. As I stated earlier, the despoiler was a solid 85 -- it came from a case of despoilers and is comparable to every other mid range 85 I have including the other 85 despoiler. Its not perfect but a great display piece. 85 does not mean perfect -- it is near mint plus.

I think its more that AFA has certain criteria when it grades that not all sellers/collectors are aware of or they might have overlooked when submitting. The subgrades are also not averaged to determine the overall grade. The card/box is weighed much heavier than the figure and the bubble. The other thing alot of submitters don't realize is that AFA won't clean the card for you or shine the bubble. If your card looks dirty, it gets a comparable grade, so if certain sellers pull higher grades, it is probably because they took the time to remove price stickers, clean the card and bubble and make sure it was a presentable piece. There is a science to the grading and if you only dabble in AFAs its easy to overlook points that might have been taken off for things like small bubble flaws or hard to see creases.

For example, a well known seller recently complained to me about a non G.I. Joe item that he had graded which he swore up and down was a straight 90. The grade it got was 85 85,85,90. I looked at it and saw a small crease in the bottom right corner and some small imperfections on the side of the bubble which that seller had overlooked. The seller still believed it deserved a 90 but I knew immediately having submitted hundreds of items that it was an 85 all day long.

Do mistakes happen, sure. AFA haters routinely cite the Transformers Beachcomber (not Cliffjumper) incident or the Jawa, but in response to that I would say at least they offered to do something about it and if at most you can only point to 2 mistakes out of 100,000+ items graded, that's a pretty good margin of error. Having collected and sold CGCs since inception, I can tell you that AFA does a much better job at being consistent than CGC and a superior job compared to most overzealoous ebay sellers.

As far as the comment about bribing, that's simply not true. The grading is anonymous and as much as I would love to get preferential treatment because I submit alot, I unfortuantely don't. For example, I have had several items that were refused to be graded for one reason or another and recently, out of a case of unopened figures, I only got 4 90s -- most were 80s and 75s -- keep in mind that's an unopened case of 36 figures.

I also find it very interesting how adamant certain AFA haters are. I remember awhile back there was a guy on the rebelscum forum that came on talking trash and making up outlandish rumors. Come to find out, he was setting up his own grading company. Now, I'm sure that's not the case here but I always wonder what drives some of the comments.

Its also very hard to find really rare high grade 9 backs like the Zap 2 handed bazooka AFA 85 that's in my store (the last one sold for $750) or AFA 90 of any MOC like the Snake Eyes ver. 3 AFA 90 that's in my store. Sorry couldn't resist the plug.

[Tattoo Shane]

Why you holding his hand, Shane? Is there something you two have in common that absolutely must be defended and revisited every time the subject comes up?

No?

Yeah, there is actually. We all think you're a tool.

It's the same old rhetoric from you directed at the same people time after time. Wah wah wah, look at PJ hatin' on the same people and the same topics. Your jealousy is so tired dude. Give it a rest for a while.

One day i'd love to see a thread about this stuff that doesn't end up with you sitting a top your righteous moral collecting horse spouting off about drivel you know nothing about calling out false accusations towards people you've never even spoken to.

[Obiwanjacoby]

I think its more that AFA has certain criteria when it grades that not all sellers/collectors are aware of or they might have overlooked when submitting. (skip) There is a science to the grading and if you only dabble in AFAs its easy to overlook points that might have been taken off for things like small bubble flaws or hard to see creases.

For example, a well known seller recently complained to me about a non G.I. Joe item that he had graded which he swore up and down was a straight 90. The grade it got was 85 85,85,90. I looked at it and saw a small crease in the bottom right corner and some small imperfections on the side of the bubble which that seller had overlooked. The seller still believed it deserved a 90 but I knew immediately having submitted hundreds of items that it was an 85 all day long.

Okay, that's cool. What that means after being "boiled down" is that AFA is very-very detailed about grading. Got it.

Do mistakes happen, sure. AFA haters routinely cite the Transformers Beachcomber (not Cliffjumper) incident or the Jawa, but in response to that I would say at least they offered to do something about it and if at most you can only point to 2 mistakes out of 100,000+ items graded, that's a pretty good margin of error.

That said, how could they miss such an obvious flaw in the piece if they're so meticulous?

And honestly, I really don't have a bone to pick with AFA or anyone who collects them. If it fails, it will surely fail on it's own merits (or lack of) and in a decade or so, they'll return to flood the market.

What gets me upset though, are people who. . .

(a.) confuse AFA with a legit appraisal service and enjoy blurring that line.

(b.) try to rationalize to others things that are obviously contradictory ("I'll ultimately never sell them. . .unless I feel like selling them." LOL!), and at the same time point out their own identity problem as collectors.

I have friends who are sealed collectors (and also dealers) that are totally honest about the way they collect. They admit that they are unashamedly hoarding items that they not only enjoy, but they feel will make a good future investment. And that there is a difference between me and them. They collect from a more adult vintage investment POV; I don't.

And I'm cool w/that. We get along quite well. And no, I don't even poke fun at the way they choose to collect.

As long as they don't spread around that "all collectors are the same" garbage, it's all good.

-PJ

[Obiwanjacoby]

Yeah, there is actually. We all think you're a tool.

What's this "we" dude? Howcome I mostly see you on these thread topics? And howcome you never name your little "we all" cabal? They're on your side, right?

It's the same old rhetoric from you directed at the same people time after time. Wah wah wah, look at PJ hatin' on the same people and the same topics. Your jealousy is so tired dude. Give it a rest for a while.

You don't really want to tolerate my opinion, you just have an axe to grind. I am fully capable of letting it go, are you? See my last post. Maybe it'll become clear.

One day i'd love to see a thread about this stuff that doesn't end up with you sitting a top your righteous moral collecting horse spouting off about drivel you know nothing about calling out false accusations towards people you've never even spoken to.

Okay, if I have falsely accused you in any way. I will make full restitution in public on this board.

Let's get the ball rolling on it and see a little making up.

You capable of that? Are you made of more gracious stuff unlike others here? Or will you keep the petty grudge Shane?

I know it's hard to let go of, because it feels good. I know it's fun to have a villain to joust against.

But I'm tired of it. Seriously.

-PJ

[Obiwanjacoby]

Your jealousy is so tired dude.

And another thing. Man. . .that quote says it all.

What am I jealous of, Shane?

Are you calling me a player hater because I like to open the box or something? What's that make other collectors who "go loose" by choice? You think there isn't such a thing?

-PJ

[Clutch II]

ok the problem is AFA is very hot and disputed topic,and no matter how innocent the discussion people will put in their 2-cents(yes thats me too)but one of the things that has irked me in this thread is how some people think i have no clue about AFA well let me tell you something about AFA a freind of mine had won awe striker AFA graded he got it cheap cause this is when they were just starting with G.I.Joe vehicles,anyway he didn't care for keeping the item sealed up so he opened the package up and guess what he found a garbage vehicle that was resealed in the package it was broken and missing parts,when he contected the seller"the seller" said thats how he got it from another seller,when he contacted AFA they said sorry but the package was opened so they are not responsible,this is fact since i was there when he opened it so if you must know why i hate AFA that is why,furthermore i will never purchase anything sealed by AFA because of that.

[Tattoo Shane]

What's this "we" dude? Howcome I mostly see you on these thread topics? And howcome you never name your little "we all" cabal? They're on your side, right?

Oh come on now, you know full well who they are.

You don't really want to tolerate my opinion, you just have an axe to grind.

Actually, that's not even close to true. I think that a lot of your opinions and posts on other topics, unrelated to collectors and all things proto, AFA, high-end etc are both valid and worthwhile. I don't think we've ever gone toe to toe in threads not discussing those have we?

Okay, if I have falsely accused you in any way. I will make full restitution in public on this board.

Sure. Remember when you got on your crusade and took me making mention on being an admin on another site completely out of context? Despite numerous posts disproving and defending what you were accusing me of, you still couldn't let it drop and just accept what i was trying to tell you could you?

How about all the times you accused me, and others, of being snobby, elitist and secretive collectors who never share anything on these boards or submit things to yojoe. That we want to *hide* everything from other collectors. I think several of us proved you wrong there right?

How about this thread: http://forums.yojoe.com/showthread.p...138#post163138

It's not directed towards me but it sure shows your colours towards certain people around here.

Should i keep going?

I certainly don't recall recieving apologies about any of those topics...

You capable of that? Are you make of more gracious stuff unlike others here? Or will you keep the petty grudge Shane?

I know it's hard to let go of, because it feels good. I know it's fun to have a villain to joust against.

But I'm tired of it. Seriously.

Oh, we're all tired of it PJ, believe you me. I like to think i'm made of pretty gracious stuff but the bottom line is, i really don't like you Paul. I haven't since our first go around and i'll never like you. It's not that i think your a villain to joust against, i just don't like you and it's easy to make you look like a monkey.

I'd be more than happy to let it all go when the day comes that you get off your high horse and stop posting self-righteous drivel like this...

"You sold out your childhood and it really stings when someone points it out."

...or any of the other left-field crap you come up with like in the thread i referenced above.

There are a LOT of people tired of your game Paul so I guess if you can agree to stop playing it then i can agree to stop all of this.

Regardless, i'm done with this one and am going to bed. Nighty night.