AFA Grading is a big issue lately....

[Average Joe]

I'm not a fan of AFA, or even sealed stuff (although I do open sealed stuff all the time), but Guts made some good points. I think there should definitely be a sealed/AFA section here.

What's the point though. A toy is a toy whether it's sealed or loose. They both fall under the TOY section.

[dockingbay97]

I'm not a fan of AFA, or even sealed stuff (although I do open sealed stuff all the time), but Guts made some good points. I think there should definitely be a sealed/AFA section here.

Basically it boils down to a forum can easily become unmanageable if you have a million categories for every small subject matter. You can quickly become overwhelmed.

I just don't see this anti MOC MISB mafia that a few people have referred to.

[Patrick A. Riley]

I've kept stuff MOC just to keep the figure mint and complete. I have no obsession with MOC or loose

I just see no way in which AFA grading can be consistent or good for many collectors. Look at the BIN prices asked for on eBay for AFA graded items when compared to non-graded items. You wanna grade 'em? Then keep 'em for yourself! Allow others to get something for a price reasonable to them and then they can choose whether to grade it or not

[NewOrder]

This site is incredibly narrow-minded. I think it is hilarious how some loose collectors are threatened by AFA and sealed collecting. Seriously, like the AFA bashers who are loose collectors have room to talk. How would you like it if all of the AFA collectors who never visit this site because they think it's a joke posted on here about how lame loose collecting is.

While I wouldn't go so far as to say that this site is incredibly narrow-minded, I would say that there is a very good deal of fan-boy facism on this site. For any that would argue otherwise, just look at all the AFA threads--or as Trent so eloquently pointed out--look at the threads that guts has previously posted in. Someone will ask a geniune question regarding AFA and there will be 10-20 subsequent posters who will impose their self-righteous collecting values onto the poster. Nevermind that they aren't even providing an answer to the orignal question, all that matters is that they get to hop on their moral pulpit and spew whatever third-hand dribble they read on another toy forum. (Just look at the site admin who, whenever given the chance, always mentions the assumed collusion between AFA, Tom Derby, and Cloud City.) Of course, my favorite is "they've been known to grade repros, reseals, and bootlegs." Exactly how many repros, reseals, and bootlegs has AFA graded? How many item has AFA graded since they've begun grading? One bootleg Beachcomber, one resealed ROTJ Admiral Ackbar and a loose Hawk? Out of 200k+ items? Wow.

Other websites have evolved and welcome all facets of collecting regardless of whether it be loose, prototype, MOC, MISB or AFA. However, this website remains a dinosaur with almost 100% loose collecting and no dedicated section for sealed or AFA collectors.

Others have brought up this concern in the past (vettefanatic, tattooshane, bigjohnwoo, guts, and maybe myself): this site remains stagant in terms of what it offers its collectors. Rebelscum has an AFA/3rd Party grader subforum which does really well. Other sites (toytraderz, behindthetoys) have prototype forums that do really well, and almost every other Star Wars site has a dedicated vintage subforum.

There are several carded/vintage collectors out there who probably would like to participate in this forum--if they didn't to tolerate comments like "no toy is worth more than $10," "why would you want something unopened," "AFA is for idiots," "I don't need someone to tell me what grade my (loose) figure is in," In X years, the rubber band will break/bubble will fall off," or cobra-empire's favorite, "that's guy's an idiot for spending that much money."

What is a shame is I and others have obtained amazing knowledge with our contacts and collecting. I have sealed items that no one has even seen and aren't pictured on yojoe. I have prototype material that no one even knew existed. I guess in my "joeverse" (and yes that's a dig) there is a forum where I can post and talk to other members about sealed or AFA items without having to read uninformed comments from AFA bashing loose collectors that don't know the first thing about high-end sealed collecting.

Given the kind of responses one typically sees on this forum regarding both AFA and prototype stuff, this isn't so much a shame as it is to be expected. Why would you or anyone else want to share anything with this site? I know Shane has never shown his Raven dynacast hardcopy on this forum (he did on another, non-GI JOE related forum), I wonder why? Would it matter? Probably not, though, because it isn't loose, you can't buy it on a Wal-Mart shelf for $5.99, and it doesn't come with 100 points of articulation.

That's my 2 cents and I'm not coming back. I encourage you to check the news this July if you still question my collecting choice.

Your original artwork, erm, I mean stuff is killer. If you ever find that joeverse, send me a link; I'd like to be in happyland, too.

[Volleydan]

This site is incredibly narrow-minded. I think it is hilarious how some loose collectors are threatened by AFA and sealed collecting. Seriously, like the AFA bashers who are loose collectors have room to talk. How would you like it if all of the AFA collectors who never visit this site because they think it's a joke posted on here about how lame loose collecting is.

I haven't seen anyone indicate that they were "threatened" by AFA collecting, and especially by sealed collecting. The criticisms I have seen about AFA have all been centered on one of two topics: (1) lack of integrity in AFA's grading process or (2) sellers and dealers - not collectors - using AFA grading as an excuse to charge inflated prices for their items. I've seen your EBay store, and I think I know why you're offended by this.

What is a shame is I and others have obtained amazing knowledge with our contacts and collecting. I have sealed items that no one has even seen and aren't pictured on yojoe. I have prototype material that no one even knew existed. I guess in my "joeverse" (and yes that's a dig) there is a forum where I can post and talk to other members about sealed or AFA items without having to read uninformed comments from AFA bashing loose collectors that don't know the first thing about high-end sealed collecting.

Man, four sentences just to tell us all how great your collection is. Are you trying to make us miss you after you're gone? A better method would be to simply stop calling people names and talking down to them......and the self-admitted "digs" don't help either. Perhaps it would also help if every AFA related discusson didn't start with "how much is ________worth AFA85". Those sort of things don't make people think of collectors, but of investors and speculators.

That's my 2 cents and I'm not coming back. I encourage you to check the news this July if you still question my collecting choice.

After posting such a condescending rant like that, do you really expect anyone to miss you?

[PrimeNYBT]

Look all I know is I am a loose collector. BUT, I get figures graded that either I won't open, won't display, Or won't play with. My most recent AFA submisson were 2 goldhead steel brigades loose complete, 2 lifttickets sealed in there baggies, and a decimator sealed in its bag. The goldheads I will never play with them. I'm more scared of damaging them. So I got them graded. Not so much for the grade but so they are safe and the can be displayed in a nice display case. The mint in baggie stuff, I won't open them, But putting them in a display case and with the U grade, I can't display them in there bags, it just looks bad.

I have a bunch of sealed on card figures. I don't search for them. These are just ones I came across for good priceand said what the heck. None of the cards are in great shape and I already have the figures loose. So I don't open them. There is no reason to open them. When i have the room they will display nicely with the loose ones

The point is, that for some, AFA is more of away to display your figures. Does the grade mean something maybe? maybe. But I'd rather be able to display them on a shelf in a really nice plastic case then have them in a cloudy bag in a draw.

I hope I made sense. I'm not trying to start a fight. Just trying to show another side of the story.

[Volleydan]

Look all I know is I am a loose collector. BUT, I get figures graded that either I won't open, won't display, Or won't play with.....I'm more scared of damaging them. So I got them graded. Not so much for the grade but so they are safe and the can be displayed in a nice display case. The mint in baggie stuff, I won't open them, But putting them in a display case and with the U grade, I can't display them in there bags, it just looks bad.

The point is, that for some, AFA is more of away to display your figures. Does the grade mean something maybe? maybe. But I'd rather be able to display them on a shelf in a really nice plastic case then have them in a cloudy bag in a draw.

I hope I made sense. I'm not trying to start a fight. Just trying to show another side of the story.

You make perfect sense - at least to me. Like you, I'm primarily a loose collector, but I come across MOC figures sometimes that I like for whatever reason and I pick 'em up.

I've considered sending some of them in just for the case, but have always decided that it's too expensive for me - especially when there are places out there that you can go and simply buy the cases for a fraction of what AFA charges.

[PrimeNYBT]

I've considered sending some of them in just for the case, but have always decided that it's too expensive for me - especially when there are places out there that you can go and simply buy the cases for a fraction of what AFA charges.

All of my figures are in cases from wholesalecases.com. They display nicely as well. But there are some figures that I would like to be in something better. The way they did the goldheads are fantastic.

[Volleydan]

there is a very good deal of fan-boy facism on this site.....there will be 10-20 subsequent posters who will impose their self-righteous collecting values onto the poster.....they get to hop on their moral pulpit and spew whatever third-hand dribble they read on another toy forum.....because it isn't loose, you can't buy it on a Wal-Mart shelf for $5.99, and it doesn't come with 100 points of articulation

I can't believe that in four pages of responses, the only insulting, flaming comments like the ones above came from the pro-AFA side. Interesting, since you're so intent on proclaiming yourselves as being somehow victimized by the rest of us. I hate to sound like a broken record, but for all of the criticism of AFA on this thread, no one has criticized AFA collectors. In fact, I've seen phrases like "to each his own" and "whatever floats your boat".

Of course, my favorite is "they've been known to grade repros, reseals, and bootlegs." Exactly how many repros, reseals, and bootlegs has AFA graded? How many item has AFA graded since they've begun grading? One bootleg Beachcomber, one resealed ROTJ Admiral Ackbar and a loose Hawk? Out of 200k+ items? Wow.

Now you're actually debating the facts instead of just being insulting. Now I can work with this. Let's say that AFA has really only made 3 errors in their entire history (unlikely, but let's go with it).

Explain to me how they can charge on a tiered schedule and maintain their integrity. Why does it cost more to grade an item worth $1000 than for one worth $20? Either they have a set of procedures that they follow to ensure that the grading process is fair and consistent or they don't. A consistent set of procedures would indicate that they do the same amount of work for each submission.....so why different fees?

It doesn't take much business acumen to know that companies will focus their efforts on their highest profit segments. For a company whose sole product is its opinion, this perception can be damaging beyond imagination.

[badbrad]